This topic contains 47 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by Mick D 14 years, 4 months ago.
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May 22, 2010 at 12:41 pm #179822
OK Mr boon
Its all about ratios
How good is ya maths :unsure:
15 teeth/45teeth on the rear
Is + or minus 1 tooth on the front= 3 less or more on the rear
So now I have made it so familar as family :blink:
I let ya try and work out the exact ratios from now on :blush:
Yaaaaah
Cheers
MurphMay 22, 2010 at 10:15 pm #179817XRTRAILHACK wrote:
Quote:I think my front is 14 and the back I dropped it down to 39 is this ok because I feel like it suits meWow :woohoo: I’m running 15/45 on my XR which is stock… Some Aussie models came with 14/42 which is the exact same as 15/45…
Here is a great gearing calculator for the XR range it is setup default for the 400 but if you know the other info you could work out your gearing quite accurately.. I was thinking of dropping my rear to 44 to get a weeee bit more legs on the top end but I guess 110 on afire trail is fast enough :cheer:
May 22, 2010 at 10:19 pm #179793Boony wrote:
Quote:now that poses the million dollar question,,whats the ratio difference from runnning your 13/47 against my 14/50??????this what I am trying to figure out???Boony.
Boony, an easier way to accurately determine which ratio you should run with and the difference between them is convert them to their base ratio. Whilst sounding complicated it couldn’t be easier.
You simply divide the rear sprocket size by the front sprocket size.
So a 13/50 combo is 50/13 = 3.846
14/47 = 3.357
14.50 = 3.571and so on…
The lower the ratio the more top speed you will carry, but at the expense of acceleration and vice versa as the ratio increases.
Use this as a way to calculate the small difference in gear ratio’s between the sprockets you are using and I would run the largest front sprocket you can at a ratio you are happy with to reduce wear.
Finally, the drive chain is only a portion of how your bike reacts to sprocket changes. Your bike has set gear ratio’s (internally in the gear box) for each and every gear. It also has what’s called a final drive ratio.
Your final drive ratio and individual gear ratio will likely be different to other bikes, but not other DRZ’s. Therefore, using the same sprockets as say Murph, on his big ass 525 with significantly more power and a different final drive won’t help.
Trial and error to get what you like, then use the calculated ratio to adjust to your liking. I hope this helps
May 22, 2010 at 11:34 pm #179825Great explanation Moto. Very helpful for the technically challenged like myself
Kram
May 22, 2010 at 11:56 pm #179826Watch who your calling “big ass” Moto :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Cheers
MurphMay 23, 2010 at 1:52 am #179827so I have a final ratio of 2.78 is that ok :blush:
May 23, 2010 at 5:09 am #179828XRTRAILHACK wrote:
Quote:so I have a final ratio of 2.78 is that ok :blush:Sure if that’s what works for you. There is no right or wrong. Nobody can say you shoul be using 3.2225554282 because it’s about what you like.
The ratio only really helps you understand the level of change from one gear ratio to another. People will say that 13/47 is the same as 14/50 (generally it is) but if you eork them out you will find that often they are slightly different.
The ratio also allows you to use the biggest front sprocket whilst maintaining the same final drive. A bigger front sprocket will reduce chain wear. If you like 13/47 (for example) you’d have a final drive of 3.615, so you could say well, if I change to a 14t front sprocket to gear longer sprocket life, what rear sprocket should I run.
Now you know the ratio you like it’s easy to work out. Take you 3.615 and multiply it by 14 which gives you 50.615. Therefore, a 51 tooth rear sprocket would give you a very similar ratio albeit ever so slightly more acceleration and less top end. If this bothered you, you could use a 50 instead.
The point is knowing the ratio’s gives you the option to make informed decisions about your gearing.
Sorry for another long post :blush:
May 23, 2010 at 5:12 am #179814Trailboss wrote:
Quote:Thats true but a larger front will alter the torque multiplication
TBCan you explain this some more please?
May 23, 2010 at 5:24 am #179829Well done Moto
According to the theory I am running at 3.714 which suits me fine
Like I said before I did try the 13 tooth sprocket on the front with the 52 on the rear but I was changing gears too often as it would peak out too quick.
Cheers
MurphMay 23, 2010 at 7:54 am #17983114.50 = 3.571
is for me, thanks moto your explanation helped with ratios, I need TB to eloborate more on his torque comment to clear up my initial question,,???should i change the front or rear???Boony
May 23, 2010 at 8:25 am #179832I’m very confident you should run the largest front you can get away with. I don’t see how torque multiplication is really a factor here. Changing to a bigger front sprocket and adjusting the rear sprocket so that you have the same final ratio does not effect the ‘torque multiplication’ in my opinion.
Torque multiplication is more commonly referred to in the truck and performance car world when specifying/adjusting/operating torque converters. Torque converters are most commonly used on vehicles with a automatic transmission.
May 23, 2010 at 10:27 am #179833moto wrote:
Quote:I’m very confident you should run the largest front you can get away with. I don’t see how torque multiplication is really a factor here. Changing to a bigger front sprocket and adjusting the rear sprocket so that you have the same final ratio does not effect the ‘torque multiplication’ in my opinion.Torque multiplication is more commonly referred to in the truck and performance car world when specifying/adjusting/operating torque converters. Torque converters are most commonly used on vehicles with a automatic transmission.
After my ride with Aaron today along the local stock route,I now have found the gearing that suits me, and yeah I will be keeping the 14 on the front and only change the rear sprocket when need be.
Cheers
BoonyMay 23, 2010 at 1:27 pm #179830moto wrote:
Quote:Trailboss wrote:Quote:Thats true but a larger front will alter the torque multiplication
TBCan you explain this some more please?
Years ago I read about the acceleration times when a bike was tested using similar final drive ratios. By using different front and rear sprocket combinations to obtain the similar, same or as close to final drive ratio as you explained. When over many tests it was found the even though the same final drive ration was used, using a smaller diameter front sprocket gave a faster rate of acceleration because less effort or power and torque was required to turn the sprocket yet the same top speed was retained by the same final ratio using a larger or smaller rear. But as pointed out here and in many threads on the site a smaller front sprocket isn’t really the go for chain wear etc
TB
May 23, 2010 at 1:36 pm #179834Boony wrote:
Quote:moto wrote:Quote:I’m very confident you should run the largest front you can get away with. I don’t see how torque multiplication is really a factor here. Changing to a bigger front sprocket and adjusting the rear sprocket so that you have the same final ratio does not effect the ‘torque multiplication’ in my opinion.Torque multiplication is more commonly referred to in the truck and performance car world when specifying/adjusting/operating torque converters. Torque converters are most commonly used on vehicles with a automatic transmission.
Nothing to do with automatic transmissions or converters, as manual transmission multiplies the torque produced by the engine through its ratios
After my ride with Aaron today along the local stock route,I now have found the gearing that suits me, and yeah I will be keeping the 14 on the front and only change the rear sprocket when need be.
Cheers
BoonyBoony sadly I have found that you can change a front sprocket a tooth either way without worrying about the chain being too long or short, but a rear normally (and I mean normally) requires the chain to be lengthened or shortened
Like Moto said find what you like and go with it, you see guys at races will change a front for a big change and say two teeth on the back for a smaller personal change. I have a few different sprocket and chain sets so I can use the same bike for a day at the Watagans or Orange pine tree singles and then change to do some silly speed at Condo. Its all pesonal right down to riding style
TB
May 24, 2010 at 3:30 am #179837T/B is indeed correct about torque values on front sprocket size.
We did the same with the kids on BMX bikes, long crankarms as practical for little legs, and as small a front sprocket and compensate with the rear to retain the optimal gearing… a very switched on bloke showed me this years ago.
But as also stated small front sprockets wear chains faster.
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