Time for our sport to mature and take control

[Bruce CurtisMember]

Ok a few points.

As CJ said it appears the NSW REC REGO model will be confined to bikes that are conplaint with the Australian Design Rules, now firstly a bike bearing an ADR approval is not necessarily superior in any way to one not bearing it.

Secondly, in VIC the rules ARE such that a MXer can be retroftted with lights and so forth and be inspected and pass, remember most ADRs are to do with tar going safety and visuals.

Thirdly, who n their right mind would dismiss some of the cutting edge MXers as a sound platform for a good enduro bike or even a good mount for a competent trail rider?

to utter that statement shows lack of experience.

Then the whole other matter, this is not the end of our sport, it is a new facet. Dickheads will still abound, dickheads on rego’d bikes, dickheads on unrego, Dickeds on Rec rego, disckheads on pitbikes, and dickheads in 4WDs too.

Dickheads are attracted to masculine pastimes, part of their little weiner complex, and another axiom i sear by.
Not every bike rider is a wanker, but rest assurred every wanker has ridden one

and CJ Burns, as i have stated across the the various mediums, as a fraternity of brothers and Sisters, we as a whole owe you and your comrades at Coffs a big Harrah for your perserverance and selfless work… three cheers for these Blokes and Blokettes.

Bruce Cee

[Scott SouthwellMember]

Mr Blue wrote:

Ok a few points.

As CJ said it appears the NSW REC REGO model will be confined to bikes that are conplaint with the Australian Design Rules, now firstly a bike bearing an ADR approval is not necessarily superior in any way to one not bearing it.

Bruce Cee

Bruce, I think you will find the powers that be in VIC are starting to realise they got it wrong on the issue of non ADR bikes. The fact is people are bypassing the laws.

The problem I see is I do agree you are right an well maintained MX bike is as safe as a ADR enduro model in its build quality. But if we are allowing non ADR vehicles into the bush does this open the argument for quad bikes, home build rock crawlers, off road buggies and the like to hit the bush legally. Heck if it doesn’t have to have ADR’s why can’t any bush mechanic bolt together a motorised contraption of sorts, whether is has 2,3,4 or even 10 wheels and get rego to hit the bush legally.

Again how do you stop the cheap shit coming from China, most of which it could be argued are dangerous as nobody has tested them. You say ADR bikes are not superior to non ADR. I would argue my DRZ is far superior to most of the Chinese shit. We have a shed full of confiscated Chinese pit bike at work. You should see some of these things, no brakes, cracked frames, etc. With lights fitted, which some of these bike come standard with anyway they are ready to hit the bush. I also would like to know if there will be ongoing rego checks for rec rego bikes. Who is making sure those with rec rego are maintaining their bikes to a safe level? For me still to many unanswered questions for me to support the idea. I need to see full well thought out details not just someone saying “similar to Victoria” that don’t help me much.

If manufacturers want there MX bikes in the bush ADR them, its been done before as you well know. If you want to race an MX bike in enduro’s there is already a race rego scheme that covers this.

[Bruce CurtisMember]

I’m not necessarily agreeing or disagreeing with any statement, I don’t think the vicco solves all issues, but a partial solution is better than none, a cure for 90% of cancers certainly beats the heck out of nothing.

I do however worry about as you said, backyarders and china pitties running around with rec rego, maybe like a list from the RTA as per competitions regs would be the go. IE: these makes and models can be eligible, I am sure the coffs MCC laddies would be only too happy to provide a list of bikes they allow at comps.

I think this is great for the likes of me, I haven’t ridden in the bush since last year due to letting my rego lapse in QLD then sheer frustration at the 120% increase in NSW in the meantime.

I would happily pay my 120 oxfords to ride 45 times a year on approved crown lands, which would be 10-15 more than I get in currently.

whereas say $600 for 30 rides is a bit of a larf…..

I see nothing but good coming from this whole Recreational Registration and insurances thing

[Scott SouthwellMember]

Bruce I think for most people 45 times a year is more than enough, certainly more than I ride and I do see the benefit for people like yourself. As for $600 a year for rego you are getting bent over. My DRZ is due next month, $366 all up and thats for city rates, country get it cheaper. Yep still more than the proposed $120 (I’ll believe that when I see it) but a long way short of $600.

[Bruce CurtisMember]

Scotty wrote:

Bruce I think for most people 45 times a year is more than enough, certainly more than I ride and I do see the benefit for people like yourself. As for $600 a year for rego you are getting bent over. My DRZ is due next month, $366 all up and thats for city rates, country get it cheaper. Yep still more than the proposed $120 (I’ll believe that when I see it) but a long way short of $600.

correction Scotty on my behalf, yes i was thinking of my roadbikes rego, not the YZs… still it went through the roof overnight, it did more than double.

also elsewhere on another fora CJburns let it be known that only around 25-30% of CTP paid by motorcyclists was being paid out, it turned out the insurance lobbyists had “Miscalculated”, and the new government is going to review, as it appears we have been getting majorly scalped for quite some time… (around 15 years) by this “miscalculating” technique.
CTP should in fact have halfed, not doubled…

It’s a bad day when we can’t trust an insurance company…:S

[GregMember]

Bruce how did your rego more than double mate? You are comparing QLD to NSW rego aren’t you to be correct? We need to compare apples and apples. Rego costs in NSW hasn’t changed bugger all if at all. Mine has always been around the 109 mark the green slip is the thing that changes and costs the most

Both my rego’ed bikes are over 650cc and are city not country, I would think yours are country classified which is cheaper. Mine are under 430 bucks rego and green slip. Maybe you need to shop around? It just seems excessive :huh:

TB

[Jim DrewMember]

Just to add a few more comments regarding Vic Rec Rego.
1 I stated that I had never considered using a MX-er as a trailer bike as I thought that they where to expensive to maintain and to unreliable over long periods of use.

2 To make a bike compliant for Rec Rego re lights it is not just a matter of bolting a headlight, tail light and hooking up a battery to make them work, they are suppose to have an on-board charging system not a toll lost unit which I would think that in to-days money would not be cheap.

3 Trail bike riding in the bush is supposed to be carried in the same manner as if you where ride on the road as the same road rules apply. The Federal and State parks and forests are for everyone to enjoy, and by no means a personal enduro track for people how are past it or can not hold there own in real competition.

4 As for those that are not of sound mind stating that ADR compliant bikes are different to MX-ers, I was not aware that there was any body on this site that is suitable qualified to make that judgement as there is quite a lot of difference other wise makers would just hang light on an MX-er and sell it as an enduro bike. Also if you people want to gain public support for your cause it would probably be an idea not to post pic’s of trying to ride up already rutted out hills and videos of of people riding down hills on unmade tracks. I to have did the same when I was younger but I gave most of that up 40 years ago, I am a firm believer in the Tread Lightly way of doing things eg treat the bush with respect and you will be able to use it , stuff it up and you’ll be locked out.
Jim Drew.

[dennis da menaceMember]

you’s are all tripping.

there is no need for ADR for Rec Rego in Vic and never has been.

in fact Vicroads have just changed the rules to allow NON ADR compliant vehicles (including trikes, quads and buggies) to be used by Cocky’s and other holders of a “primary producers” or “farmers” rego within a few KMs of their property.
the chinese shit will flood in here for them.

no one checks up on rec rego either Scotty, just like they dont with our cars either. no yearly RWC for us.
green slips and pink slips are just feeding the hungry insurance bastards.

also ADR has little to do with quality control. it has more to do with headlight glare and taillight sizes and steering locks, than how good your frame is welded together or whether you can bend your handlebars by hand :laugh: :laugh:

its a good thing when properly used.

but like they say, “locks only keep the honest thieves out”.

[scott bockingMember]

It is funny when you read back through this thread that us, the user group, are completely divided on the issue so what chance do the policy makers have of keeping us happy :laugh:

STM

[dennis da menaceMember]

jimbo wrote:

Just to add a few more comments regarding Vic Rec Rego.
1 I stated that I had never considered using a MX-er as a trailer bike as I thought that they where to expensive to maintain and to unreliable over long periods of use.

2 To make a bike compliant for Rec Rego re lights it is not just a matter of bolting a headlight, tail light and hooking up a battery to make them work, they are suppose to have an on-board charging system not a toll lost unit which I would think that in to-days money would not be cheap.

3 Trail bike riding in the bush is supposed to be carried in the same manner as if you where ride on the road as the same road rules apply. The Federal and State parks and forests are for everyone to enjoy, and by no means a personal enduro track for people how are past it or can not hold there own in real competition.

4 As for those that are not of sound mind stating that ADR compliant bikes are different to MX-ers, I was not aware that there was any body on this site that is suitable qualified to make that judgement as there is quite a lot of difference other wise makers would just hang light on an MX-er and sell it as an enduro bike. Also if you people want to gain public support for your cause it would probably be an idea not to post pic’s of trying to ride up already rutted out hills and videos of of people riding down hills on unmade tracks. I to have did the same when I was younger but I gave most of that up 40 years ago, I am a firm believer in the Tread Lightly way of doing things eg treat the bush with respect and you will be able to use it , stuff it up and you’ll be locked out.
Jim Drew.

jimbo,

1- fair enough you never want an MXer but plenty of blokes do, thats their perogative.
there isnt any more maintance on an MXer, well i cant see how their would be. (ie; i ride a 300EXC-e, the maintenance is the same for the MX version)

2- anyone can go to Ballards and buy a “Rec Rego Lighting Kit” for about $160. it runs off the primary side of the CDI and therefore is a not full loss system and is considered legal for rec rego.
it has 3 led’s for a headlight, 1 for tail, 2 for braekes and the associated loom to hook it up.
it is as useless as tits on a bull, but it IS legal.

3- youre right, the forests are for everyone and unless signed are a 60km/h zone in victoria (i think, if not, 100km/h).
i ride tracks that i couldnt do 60km/h through on my best day but i know fella’s that could smash that if they wanted to.
does that make them hoons, cause they ride faster than me but within the laws of federal and state?
i dont htink so.
in fact if you wanna be picky Jimbo, everytime your rear tyre breaks traction you are committing an offence, just like doing a burnout in a car:whistle:
we all get old and slow down, time for us to sit back and watch the young cocks do what we used to do….. stack!!

4- as i stated in my earlier post, ADR has more to do with shit like,
minimum tailight size and proper lensing,
non glaring headlight for oncoming drivers,
must be key lockable, by ignition or steering lock,
must have a stand that flicks up when not used,
must have reflectors viewable for all angles,
must have certain sized indicators,
must have a chainguard,
a speedo,
high beam and turning lamps on dash,

etc,etc,etc.

the Euro manufacturers mostly make an ADR comliant MXer, sold as an enduro. the Japs dont as they dont see the market with their funny little eyes. :laugh: :laugh:
how many KTMs, Bergs and Huskis do you see now on the trails….
they are like aresoles, everyone has one…
and for good reason.

and the rest of your ranton #4, we all know…

and respect.

cheers,

menace

[dennis da menaceMember]

singletrackmind wrote:

It is funny when you read back through this thread that us, the user group, are completely divided on the issue so what chance do the policy makers have of keeping us happy :laugh:

STM

its a crackup Scott :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

im all for it!!

and ironically i DONT have rec rego…

just so i can ride North of the border with you lot:laugh:

the things i do

[Craig HattonMember]

IMO I think rec rego is a mistake, and we don’t need to go down that path.

MX bikes are not suited to bush riding, Fuel capacity, cooling system, wiring to keep lights going, 19 wheels, high reving, no low down torque etc -they are just not made for it.
Now I willing to cop some flack but thats my opinion.

Everybody is on about the costs of rego, but it’s the greenslips which are the issue. We would be better of lobying to get them reduced, than to open up the floodgates. We are then all covered for accidents, we are seen by the powers at be to be doing the right thing, which in turn give our sport more lobbying power as a united group.
If obtaining rec rego gives you access to the bush for 45 days, based on my rego, that equals $8.60 for the rego component, there is not many sports that you can do for that piss arse amount-so don’t use the rego cost as an excuse, put $5.00 in a jar every day you go riding and you will almost have your rego covered.
If mx was as good as enduro, for riding in the bush why would the manufactures spend millions on 2 different types of bikes, each bike is suited to it design, thats why they are different.

If adr compliant bikes are not required in this country than the manufactures will stop importing them, the government will not allow you to ride on public land, and you can then go and enjoy riding the mx park with every other bike rider because the bush will be off limits. The green minorities win and you have helped their cause.

If you are hell bent on riding a motorcross bike in the bush, take it up with the manufacturers, lobby them to produce the bikes you want to ride adr compliant – (they won’t because they are not suited)- follow what is going on in the US and you will appreciate how lucky we are to have adr bikes and riding areas across the board in this country.
What I see happening is, that rec rego comes in, restrictions on where you can ride those bike becomes law, more bikes in a concentrated area = more damage to the environment, which gives the opposition more fuel for closing down more bush and then the sport is history.

What is the advantage of rec rego, what does rec rego give you over and above what you can have /do have now.

Hatto

[dennis da menaceMember]

and just to throw a spanner in the works…

i saw this on another site just now and had to laugh.

ADR cant be that hard to get, it has NSW rego :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[WayneMember]

Hatto wrote:

…….
Everybody is on about the costs of rego, but it’s the greenslips which are the issue.

Hatto

Don’t start me on greenslips Hatto……..

my garbage truck renewal is over $4000.00 this year!

Crash

[drewMember]

that’s not a Sherco 50 SM is it??

or a Honda ‘Monkey’ bike that was ADR tricked up a bit??

if not i wanna know how to get a bike ADR’d :S :whistle:

….

well said Hatto.

i too feel rec reg will only lead to more trouble than it’s worth.

a quick thought i just had, maybe bring in a quarterly rego so the younger riders that may only ride in say summer can afford to get reg. hopefully to cut down on the un-reg. riders.

but i reckon no matter how affordable a rego may be there are those that will defy the law no matter what. and there are those that cannot hold a license due to age or disqualification will not be able to reg a bike anyway. let alone some sort of insurance.

for those that say reg is just far too dear. budget like i do, set aside a nominal amount each pay so you have the money on hand when it comes around, instead of getting the renewal in the mail and going ‘ how can i afford this?.’

yes i feel the reg, or more to the point the CTP for NStroubleyou residence, is a bit rich in comparison to a car. my 625cc bike is around the same as my 1.8t 5.0L car..

but what can you do.

on another (car) forum there is a thread on third party property insurance being compulsory…. something i haven’t had for years. but this year round i’ll price it and see if my budget will cover it.

Menace as for you going to all the trouble of full reg. i don’t think any of the Vic. Bulls have rec reg.

but we northerners do appreciate the extra mile you put in.

we just did’t want to let you know..

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